Speaker 2: 0:06

Welcome to the Uncomplicated Perimenopause Podcast. I'm Kate Grosvenor, your friendly perimenopause expert and life coach.

Speaker 3: 0:15

And I'm Gabriella Kate's daughter, representing all the women who are nowhere near perimenopause but want to understand it better.

Speaker 2: 0:23

Whether you're just starting your perimenopause journey deep into it, whether you're just starting your perimenopause journey deep into it or you're a loved one trying to support someone who is we've got you covered.

Speaker 3: 0:32

We'll be answering all of your burning questions, exploring the ups and downs, and sharing expert advice and personal insights.

Speaker 2: 0:39

So grab a cup of tea, get comfy and let's dive into the wonderful. Get comfy and let's dive into the wonderful, sometimes wild, world of perimenopause together.

Speaker 3: 0:47

And remember, no matter where you are on your journey, you are not alone.

Speaker 2: 1:00

Welcome to the Uncomplicated Perimenopause. Hello, my darlings, and welcome to episode six of the Uncomplicated Perimenopause Podcast, season 2.

Speaker 3: 1:06

I'm Kate Grosvenor, I'm a perimenopause expert and life coach and I'm Gabriella Grosvenor, Kate's daughter, here to learn with you all. We've not done the whole intro in a while.

Speaker 2: 1:15

I thought we did it last week reasonably okay.

Speaker 3: 1:17

No, because the second we finished, we were like yes, we did it.

Speaker 2: 1:21

Well, I mean we've had time off. Yeah, well, I mean we've had time off. Yeah, we, I actually had time off. Yeah, you have, it's weird, it's weird it's very, it's very weird for me.

Speaker 3: 1:28

Yeah, you said you felt guilty and I'm like stop it, it's boxing day, it's it's a law.

Speaker 2: 1:33

I know you don't work.

Speaker 3: 1:34

Boxing day, yes, but I've lasted a few days this time yes, and we will work on a bit more time off in 2025.

Speaker 2: 1:41

Yes, we're going to do that? Um, I was actually playing a game on my phone, though, to keep me busy.

Speaker 3: 1:46

I was cheating what game was it, though? I don't really know. Was it that one where you build farms? Yes, I've been building farms. You and I both have one of them.

Speaker 2: 1:53

You build farms, I build apartment complexes, okay but I've only been doing that to keep my brain busy. Scott caught me doing the other day and he's like what are you doing, grover, and that we didn't call it groveling. Call me kate, obviously I call myself groveling. And he's like what are you doing? And I was like, well, I have to do something, because I'm so like used to checking my phone constantly for work and messages and you know all these kind of things that I had to check my phone, so I cheated and created a really rubbish game yeah, not gonna lie.

Speaker 3: 2:21

Rowan came and told me about this game that you, she, yeah, yeah, yeah, sneaky little bugger, she was talking shit about it. Yeah, I don't want, I got your back. I defended you. I was like and what?

Speaker 2: 2:30

And I built apartments, okay, and how often do. You do it Every day, daily.

Speaker 3: 2:35

Really, I've built my own little like.

Speaker 2: 2:37

Is it like a global empire now?

Speaker 3: 2:40

No, it's like a compound. So is it still a compound? Yeah, when did you start? A month ago, okay, wow, just stimulates my brain.

Speaker 2: 2:47

I don't know what I'm going to do when I get back to work, because I don't have time to do it, because it's a commitment. It is Like you have to build things and pay for things.

Speaker 3: 2:58

So in the farm I have to wait, like plant stuff, and let it grow. When I sit down, when I sit down and eat, I'm like, okay, next apartment, I can build it now. I just need to furnish. This need to furnish that does that make us sad?

Speaker 2: 3:08

I don't know maybe, but we have had time off and it's been lovely your cousin's been over and it's been absolutely lovely. We've had lots of giggles to time off.

Speaker 3: 3:16

I've had more time off but being out, which I'm tired. I'm not used to going out this much I like my, you've been peopling. Yeah, just a lot.

Speaker 2: 3:25

I've been sleeping, I'm chilling.

Speaker 3: 3:26

Do you want to swap for a bit? No.

Speaker 2: 3:29

I'm all good. Anyhow, we hope you've had a beautiful Christmas and are looking forward to the new year. Do let us know what your New Year's resolutions are. I've got some fabulous ones. We're going to do them, because I've got all that paper so I've got to do something with it.

Speaker 3: 3:42

Okay, yeah, we're free yeah cool Coolsies, let's do it.

Speaker 2: 3:45

Let's get Oma involved as well. Do boys do vision boards?

Speaker 3: 3:48

They will now.

Speaker 2: 3:49

They will now Let us know. Do seriously let us know on our WhatsApp number. I don't know what it is, but it'll be in the show notes. Have done vision boards? Send us a picture, yes, please. We'd love to see it, honestly, we'd love to see it. We'll publish them. If you have done a vision board, we will put it on our social media and give you a shout out, because we'd love to, so you can send it to us on our instagram. You can send it to us on facebook.

Speaker 3: 4:15

Yeah, we um what's up?

Speaker 2: 4:17

I don't know what our social media handle is, because it wasn't the full thing, was it? You can find us because we couldn't use the uncomplicated perimenopause podcast. It was too long. Yeah, I don't actually know what it is they can message you on k grover now you can just find us. Find us and send it to us, because we would love to see your vision boards and we will share ours when we've done ours okay, maybe I don't know what mine will be, but yeah it'll be cool z's.

Speaker 2: 4:39

So, my darling, what is the question for today?

Speaker 3: 4:41

so it's actually not a very long one.

Speaker 2: 4:43

Oh cool, that's probably about right for my brain Not going to lie.

Speaker 3: 4:46

She needed help. Okay, so she hasn't left her age. It's Amy, hi Amy, and she lives in Luton. Where's Luton?

Speaker 2: 4:53

Down south.

Speaker 3: 4:54

Down south, not far from London.

Speaker 2: 4:56

Oh yeah, the airport.

Speaker 3: 4:57

Yeah.

Speaker 2: 5:05

Horrible is it? It's a horrible airport, worst effort I've ever been to my life. I really hate it. The funniest airport I've ever been to my life was in kosamui in thailand. So I got this is back in 19 sorry digress one second, this is back in 1990, I'm gonna say five and we flew. So we flew from japan, from osaka, to bangkok, so the night, bangkok, then flew from bangkok to kosamui, but yeah, bangkok to go somewhere. And we arrived and there was just like a little wooden sign that said airport. Stayed the night in Bangkok, then flew from Bangkok to Koh Samui, but yeah, bangkok to Koh Samui. And we arrived and there was just like a little wooden sign that said airport and they didn't have refreshments, apart from water that didn't look like we should drink it, and then just some, like a bucket full of bananas.

Speaker 3: 5:35

I would go there it was so cool, I would go there it was like five dollars a night for a hut?

Speaker 2: 5:41

Well, I didn't. I upgraded To what? To a little bit of a bigger hut With running water.

Speaker 3: 5:45

Oh mummy, no, well, it wasn't a hut.

Speaker 2: 5:48

It was more like a room With a bed. Huts are the best to sleep in? Yeah, you know me.

Speaker 3: 5:53

You're about 95 old, were you?

Speaker 2: 5:54

21.

Speaker 3: 5:56

You're capable of sleeping in a hut.

Speaker 2: 5:57

I don't do camping in huts and stuff. Anyway, carry on. So I digress, amy from Luton.

Speaker 3: 6:02

Yes, Sex is painful. Help Period Full stop. Exclamation point Short and sweet one Short and sweet.

Speaker 2: 6:08

Right, sex is period. Help. What Sex is painful? No, sex is painful, right? Okay. So first of all, we have to explain why sex is painful. I don't know why. Vagina, really well, most of it's about the vagina, some of it's mental, as in mindset it can be, so it's much more difficult to become aroused in perimenopause.

Speaker 3: 6:31

We've talked about intimacy. Yeah, in episode four, episode of this of this season oh so it's like two episodes ago.

Speaker 2: 6:39

So intimacy is is is more difficult in perimenopause because rage is a thing, and go back a couple of episodes and you'll know why but intimacy is much more difficult. It's more difficult to get into the mood of it just because of that whole met inside feeling and the less aroused you can be because of your you know you're going to be just you're less likely to be aroused. But go back to episode four of the series and you'll you'll hear more about it. What I'd like to concentrate more is actually what's happening in your vagina. Some words you never normally say in a polite society um, but, but this is. It's really really important to have a conversation about this. I'm curious you may or may not be by the time I finish I'm curious.

Speaker 3: 7:23

I I don't know if I'm going to be yeah you're curious.

Speaker 2: 7:25

You may not want the answer. Okay, so here's the honest truth on this. Are you ready? Vaginas are oestrogen receptor. We're oestrogen sensitive, meaning the tissue of the vagina before you enter perimenopause. It is plump and moist. Plump, plump. What do you mean? Plump, plump. So you know, your skin here right is plump.

Speaker 3: 7:51

Okay, what's it? I'm in a panic.

Speaker 2: 7:55

She's panicking already.

Speaker 3: 7:57

What is a non-plump vagina? Shriveled and dry.

Speaker 2: 8:00

No way, mm-hmm. So, basically, the tissue, tissue, like your tissue on your cheek, is plump when it has collagen, when it has oestrogen. Okay that your, your, your. The tissue of your vagina, the walls of your vagina are oestrogen sensitive, okay, oestrogen kind of receptive. So when you lose your, when you go through perimenopause, you lose oestrogen. As the oestrogen leaves your body, your vagina can atrophy, meaning um the walls become, of which your vagina become thinner, like it's like a muscle as well. You you lose um strength in your vagina and you can also lose the plumpness of your vagina inside so it's a two-way thing, so you're looking if you could see her face, just like if you were listening to this on a podcast.

Speaker 2: 8:47

You're listening to this. I'm I'm really getting scared now because her face is like I'm it's, it's like I've kicked a puppy, really honestly, okay so let me sort my face out, sort your face, have a conversation with your face inside.

Speaker 2: 8:59

So there's two, two things. So the strength of your vagina you can lose the strength of your vagina and you can lose the plumpness of your vagina, right? So we need to address both. Okay. So the pelvic floor, as in the thing that you know, when you go for a pee and you stop the pee, okay, that's your pelvic floor that does that, that's the muscle contracts. Okay, and if you have a well, a weak pelvic floor, you, if you sneeze, you pee yourself yeah, okay, now that's an issue for women in perimenopause, so a lot of us have leaky bladders um, so you know.

Speaker 2: 9:36

That's why period knickers are a great idea.

Speaker 2: 9:39

But a bigger issue is vaginal atrophy, meaning the vagina itself has lost its plumpness hmm, um and um, so that what happens then is when you have, when you're intimate with your partner the male partner I'm talking about specifically, but also a female partner, if you're using anything for penetrative sex, um, it's the the vagina walls become very thin and they become quite fragile, quite tissue like, and so anything that's inserted into the vagina feels like it's, instead of it being the vagina walls, getting lubricated. Yeah, because you get turned on, so you get lubrication. You grow well, this one is like garish or zank toes are curly, but when you get, when you get excited, you get lubrication, and then the vagina kind of stretches to be receptive for sex please?

Speaker 3: 10:33

I'm really sorry.

Speaker 2: 10:34

I'm trying, I'm trying, I'll just look at the camera. Okay, I'm gonna look at the camera and not look at her. All right, so when you, when you get receptive for sex, your vagina kind of like expands, gets it and and you kind of are receptive for penetration, right, I'm not looking at her, I'm trying to block the camera as well on that bit. Okay, so really awkward with your daughter.

Speaker 2: 10:58

Um, the point being, when your vagina walls get thinner, it can tear not not tear as in rip open, but you can kind of get that friction and you can get small tears.

Speaker 2: 11:10

And so what then happens is it feels really uncomfortable.

Speaker 2: 11:12

So it kind of get that friction and you can get small tears, and so what then happens is it feels really uncomfortable, so it kind of like, instead of going in and out smoothly, it kind of gets jaggy, and so it becomes really painful, especially for the first few minutes.

Speaker 2: 11:25

And then why would you, why would you bother yourself? Yeah, so then the point is well, I can't be arsed because I'm not really massively in the mood, or I am in the can't be arsed because I'm not really massively in the mood, or I am in the mood but it's painful, or I'm not in the mood and it's painful, yeah, so then it becomes a big issue. So then what can happen is not only can it be painful during sex, but it can be you can bleed after sex because you can have done some damage. Yeah, then what can happen is you can get some kind of infection, because if you've kind of torn bits inside, you can end up with a small infection, not a massive infection, not like gashed yourself yeah, but you know, some kind of uti or some kind of you know infection going on.

Speaker 2: 12:08

Yeah, not pleasant, yeah, but women will try things like artificial lubes. Yeah, do you know, like durex type things which are kind of greasy serene and they can be quite unpleasant when you have to apply them in quantity, because it's not so where'd you put the lube?

Speaker 2: 12:30

well, this is the problem. So that kind of lube is designed to use more or less on the outside or the or the just the entrance of the vagina. It's not designed for vaginal atrophy like inside. So you know, it's designed to help just a little bit on the way, but it's not really that great and quite a lot of women can feel very uncomfortable if it's used in large quantities, you know. So what do we do? This is more the point. So that's the. That's the whole unpleasantness over with.

Speaker 3: 13:04

You can read it was in that moment she knew, yeah, it's gonna be like we need to do a slow-mo of me going so what?

Speaker 2: 13:15

what happens? My best advice is go and see your gp, your sexual health clinic or your nurse practitioner, because there are a lot of things you can actually do about this. Most women will think I don't want to talk about it, I don't want to know what's going on. Please, please, please, please, do something about it, because there's a lot you can do about it. If you went to see your somebody your health clinic there's a very simple thing they can do. They may or may not examine you, okay. So if you went to your because okay, let me go backwards if you went to see your nurse practitioner or your gp and you said to them I think I have vaginal atrophy. If you're already on hrt, um, they may increase your hrt because it's estrogen receptive. It's estrogen. It's a problem caused by lack of estrogen. If you're on a very low dose of hrt, they may increase your hrt. Is that necessarily going to cure the problem?

Speaker 3: 14:11

Yeah, I was going to ask does that actually help?

Speaker 2: 14:13

It will help, but it's not targeted specifically. So it could help-ish, it might help that and then, but you might end up taking too high a dose and it's not targeted specifically at the area. So what do you then do? Right? And there's also women, by the way, who can't take hrt for whatever reason, who may also have this problem. Now the research does show us and you, by the way, you must check with your oncologist and your gp that the, the topical lesion that I'm going to talk about, doesn't necessarily cross the barrier. So you may still be able to take topical estrogen, even if you can't take hr, like the, the estrogen, like the oral estrogen or the eastern patches. So if, even if you can't take standard hrt, you may still be able to take topical hrt for your vaginal atrophy or something. So it's worth still checking, by the way, for any women that that um can't take um standard hrt. So go and see your oncologist, tell them you suspect you have a, you know, vaginal atrophy. If sex is really really painful, can't take standard HRT. So go and see your oncologist. Tell them you suspect you have vaginal atrophy. If sex is really really painful, you'll know as well if it's painful when you wipe yourself because it can be painful. Just wiping yourself after the loo. Yeah, it's unpleasant, sweetheart, it's not nice. Good news is you've got another 25 years to worry about before you start to worry about these things. If you, if you go to your doctor, you tell them I suspect I have vaginal atrophy, they'll say why do you think you've got that? And you'll say it's painful.

Speaker 2: 15:40

You know, if you you might have bleeding after sex, you know, and it won't be like gushes of blood. It'll be drops of bright red blood, because it's not period blood. So you'll know the difference. It's bright redMed. There'll be no lining in there or anything like that. There's no fibrous tissue. It'll be spotting the day after. It'll be spotting just after. If you wore a panty liner it would be perfectly doable. It's not huge amounts of blood. So you'd go there and they may or may not say that they'd like to do a cervical examination. Why would they want to do a cervical examination? It's because they want to check there's nothing else causing the problem. So they want to check that your cervix is okay and there's nothing else that's causing the unpleasantness on your cervix. That's good standard practice. They're not trying to scare you, they're just trying to make sure there's nothing else in that area that could be in there that's causing a problem yeah so that when you're having sex it's painful, it may not.

Speaker 2: 16:37

If they suspect there's nothing else going on, they may just say, yeah, no problems, okay. So there's things that they can give you. Most likely they will give you either a cream or a pessary. What's a pessary? So a pessary is like, um, like a little ovum or egg or or a like the size of a do you know, like the tiny little Cadbury's easter eggs, that kind of like that, and you put it in there. You put it in there. Or a cream, right, put it in there, yes, darling how. And it stays in there. No, it dissolves, all right, okay, okay.

Speaker 2: 17:15

Or a cream that looks like a tampon. So it's like, um, so it kind of comes in a tube. You put the cream in there and you insert it. Probably, I'm gonna say, once you put, you use it maybe once every two, once a day, for two weeks, and then you'd use it, I don't know, every other day for a week, something like that, and then use it once every two weeks and then you gradually wean it off and then you should have your results and then you'd go back and have a review, maybe after two, three months, something like that. So you, you, you kind of use it a lot in the first few weeks and then you wean it off and then basically your vagina's had a lovely heavy dosage of estrogen back in back into it and then they review you and check that everything's okay in two, three months or like that right so that's something that you can do and, as I said, that's you know, it's it.

Speaker 2: 18:06

would everybody go? Oh, do you know what I'd like to do today? I'd like to go to the doctors and have a conversation about my vagina, no, and I'd like the doctor to say oh, yes, you do have vaginal atrophy. How lovely, because they would go and have a look at your vagina, have a look at your cervix and go yes, you have vaginal atrophy, how delightful. But is it a conversation that would really benefit you Absolutely? I mean, once you've had if you've had kids, you've had enough people look up your foo-foo by now.

Speaker 3: 18:33

Your foo-foo, your foo-foo. After all same vagina, now it's foo-foo. I'm joking.

Speaker 2: 18:37

I mean, do you know what I mean? Once you've reached our age, how many cervical smears have you had? It's no different, it's really, really. It's almost the same procedure, apart from they're not taking a swab, they're just having a look. So, procedure, just to put women's minds at ease, the procedure is almost identical, okay.

Speaker 3: 19:00

The only difference is they're not taking a swab. They're literally just how can they tell doctors? I didn't know.

Speaker 2: 19:03

I need a doctor? Okay, but they just look at your cervix just to make sure there's nothing else okay sinister going on.

Speaker 2: 19:10

It's just, your cervix is completely clear, as it should be, and then they look at the walls of your vagina and they say, yes, your vagina does look atrophied. And then they'll say, right, here's your cream or your pessary. And then they can. Also, if you want to and I suggest that you do they can also prescribe you a water-based lube. Okay, rather than an oily lube, or rather than a kind of glycerin lube that you would use, yeah, condoms or something. And that's a prescription, that's a prescription one. And so you can get a prescription for water-based lube and for, um, the cream as well, and when you combine those two things together, you should find it much, much easier, um, to find it much more more comfortable. The other thing that I would say so that's the, the kind of medical thing, and really, really, please do go and have a conversation yeah like I genuinely I don't think enough women know about this and have a conversation about it.

Speaker 2: 20:15

And please, please, please, have a conversation with your partner yeah, because what they will worry about. Trust me, they will worry that you're no longer turned on by them, because they will think well, you know, she was turned because they learn the basics right. They learn that if you were turned on by them, you would be, you know, welcoming to them, and so would your body parts.

Speaker 2: 20:38

Let's leave it like that okay okay, well said thank you um, so they then feel if, if you're not, therefore you're not turned on by them, so it must be them right that you just don't want them anymore. So if you have a conversation with them and do you know what is it? The sexiest topic on the planet? No, will you survive the conversation? Yeah, you should be able to is it necessary? It is because then you can say to them the end of this drought period is nigh it was nigh, it's nigh yes, because I'm, I'm sorting it out.

Speaker 2: 21:08

And and the thing is, if you say to them, you know, this is what I'm doing, this is why I'm doing it, I think this is actually important and I'm prioritizing it. They were like huzzah, you know, even if you're not, you're not promising them, and then I'm gonna get back in the saddle, yeehaw you know you're not.

Speaker 2: 21:25

Oh my god but do you know what I mean? You know? Then I'm, then I'm like whatever, like I'm going to act like I'm 20 years old again, but what you're saying to them is I'm. I see the importance of this and I'm prioritizing this. I know that this is an important part of our relationship. Yeah, Because we've had this conversation many times. All you said the thing about relationships in perimenopause between partners is and I've had this conversation one of my friends said to me she's gay and she's 50. And she said to me the other day her partner's quite considerably younger than her. I think her partner's in her late 30s. And she said to me the day she goes my girlfriend thinks I don't fancy her anymore genuinely. She said my girlfriend thinks, because she's not started the pyramid, what she's late 30s. And she said my girlfriend thinks I don't fancy her genuinely. And this is woman to woman is like, because she doesn't have any of the symptoms. She hasn't had any of the conversations.

Speaker 3: 22:24

Spider sorry.

Speaker 2: 22:25

Okay, bless. She hasn't had any of the symptoms, she hasn't had any of the conversations, she knows nothing about this. Yeah, and she said to me my girlfriend just thinks I don't fancy her you should send this podcast episode to them. Yeah, yeah, I'll send it to her. But do you see what I mean? It's like it's a universal. Then she doesn't fancy me. Yeah, yeah, because, yeah, if she did fancy me she'd want to.

Speaker 3: 22:51

She'd want to right.

Speaker 2: 22:53

so just by saying I'm prioritizing this because I know this is an issue, I know my body not an issue as in like shame on you, but an issue as in my body is not doing what I would like it to just for yourself, even if you're single, you should not, you should, should. I hate the word should because it's very judgy, but you can do this simply because it helps you to avoid some of the UTIs. It helps you. It can do because obviously, if you get infections and stuff, but just literally wiping yourself off the loo can be really, really uncomfortable and it just feels nice and not to have that as an issue.

Speaker 3: 23:32

Is that not when you have an infection as well? It hurts when you wipe, it hurts when you pee.

Speaker 2: 23:37

Well, utis are different. So UTIs are very, very different because the uti is like literally a water infection, so that's a completely different. But it can be a source of because friction and you know, in little tears and stuff can be a contributing factor too, but it's not the main cause of it, okay.

Speaker 3: 23:55

But it can be a contributing okay factor because women in in perimenopause will get more utis than they've ever had in their life my fufu hurts just thinking, just thinking like I'm thinking of all this, my fufu hurts. Yeah, I kind of like that word.

Speaker 2: 24:08

Yeah, yeah but it's so. In answer to why does it hurt? Help vaginal atrophy is is one of the biggest causes. For sure the lube will help as well.

Speaker 2: 24:22

Um, spending more time on foreplay will help as well and just making sure your partner is is included in the conversation, and just taking your time and just making sure that you're not. It's difficult, I mean, I don't know, obviously, I don't know how old amy, doesn't know how old she is, I don't know if she has little kids, but it's, it's just making sure that you, you have time to take things slow her profile picture had a kid with her in it, if that helps.

Speaker 3: 24:52

The kid looked about seven, but it could have been any time, so I mean that's.

Speaker 2: 24:55

That's an issue when you come to taking your time and what have you, but hopefully she finds that helpful. Please, amy, please, please, please, and anyone that's listening out there do go and have that conversation. I know it's a tad awkward, it's not the easiest one, but if you go in there armed with this information and bear in mind that this is not the first conversation that your doctor or your nurse will have had about this common cause, issue. Hopefully, and they've seen more.

Speaker 2: 25:23

And if they do ask for a check, it's actually the same as a smear test, apart from they don't take a swab, so it's less invasive, actually Much less invasive.

Speaker 2: 25:32

I mean, it's just the same kind of apparatus type thing, but you'll be really really glad that you did and the prescription is just a cream and then some lube and then you'll feel so much better and they may just say, yeah, and you know, they may recommend increasing your estrogen, part of your hrt as well, but you don't have to increase your your estrogen because the topical obviously the topical um estrogen is the best, best thing for because it's directly applied, so that should help great. I'd like to say an and a happy new year. Yeah, what a lovely conversation for a happy 2025. But it's important. It is because I guarantee there's women out there that desperately need to have that conversation and I'm here to answer that.

Speaker 3: 26:23

I'm just thinking about my little sister, who's going to edit this as well.

Speaker 2: 26:27

Meh, meh. Well, do you know what? We're all girls and it's important to know these things. Okay. Because once you know them, that's it.

Speaker 3: 26:37

I will never forget. Well, do you know them? That's it.

Speaker 2: 26:39

I will never forget well, do you know what the thing is? My mum never even had you know this, never even had a conversation about periods with me. So the more you know about your own biology, the more you know about your own sexual health, the more you know about everything to do with reproductive systems and stuff. The more informed, the more well armed you are yeah, so you never know when that information could be useful. Cool. Alright, my loves, so we hope you've had a beautiful Christmas. We hope you have a beautiful new year.

Speaker 2: 27:08

If you've got a vision board, please do tag me, or tag us. We want to see it and we'll give you a shout out and repost it on our stories or something. Give us some inspiration, yeah, and if, as always, if, you have any questions that you'd like us to talk about, bear in mind there's pretty much no, nothing we won't talk about when it comes to perimenopause. Take care, my darlings. Have a gorgeous week and we will speak to you soon. Bye, thanks for joining us today on the uncomplicated perimenopause podcast.

Speaker 3: 27:48

We hope you found this episode helpful and inspiring, don't forget if you have any questions or topics you'd like us to cover, you can reach out through our perimenopause group or on WhatsApp For more information on my coaching, perimenopause supplements, books or upcoming events, please visit wwwkatebrovnercom. And if you've enjoyed today's episode, please subscribe, rate and review our podcast. It really helps us reach more listeners, just like you, until next time, remember perimenopause, doesn't have to be complicated. We're here to help you every step of the way. Stay uncomplicated.